Seems the digital production of "Sky Captain and the World of Tomorrow" are using OSX for the editing of the project.

In this short article about the production:

Back in LA at the WOT offices, Jessen digitized the tapes sent over from the London shoot using a Sony HDW-F500 deck and AJA’s Kona HD capture card — which was, when the production started using it, the only HD capture solution that worked under OS X, according to Jessen. In fact, the Kona card was so new that, in order to get hold of it, WOT became a beta user for several months. “And it worked beautifully,” Jessen reports.[i].....

[i]Once the visual effects team had worked on a version of the shot, Jessen would then bring it back into Final Cut Pro. “The shot was then assessed,” he adds, “and it was a slow progression sometimes. But it needed to be viewed in HD also, so we could also play the HD out of the Kona card to an HD monitor, and then the director and visual effects supervisor could assess it critically. And every comp that came in was looked at through an HD card on an HD monitor before being approved.

Hmmmmmm.

You're right. It could very well have been a pro because one time I saw a man create an intricate wood carving with a chainsaw. That takes skill.

They did just the off-line editing in Final Cut, the online final version was done in a high-end system and then shot on film.

“If we’d shot on film and done all the effects on film it would have been so expensive and time consuming, as we would have had to scan all the footage. But by using the HD Kona card, we could bring all the footage directly into our workflow and right into the computer and onto our server. So we could create a low-res version of all the footage and then use that in our offline cut. 

Then, when we decided that a particular take was going to be used in the final film, the capture footage using the Kona card was given to the visual effects team, and they started using it there.”

The Kona was probably the only low-cost HD desktop solution at the time.

“They shot around the end of 2002, and basically we’ve been working on the editing ever since.”

Yep, it sounds a lot like OS X...

I read stuff like that, and can't BELIEVE that there are pros in the world who don't consider OS X a beta platform.

The other laugh is Pixar and Lucasarts using OS X. Dig deeper, and you see that many don't do any actual WORK on it, that they save for more specialized non-Apple workstations... but more for visualization. In other words, busywork lol.

You have to remember that geeks with juicy chessclub brains are all about finding the most complicated route between point a and point 2. They're just not happy unless they can find a clumsy workaround.

They crap-settle for hardware limitations all the time. Why? Because finding those workarounds is a friggin' BRAIN TEASER to them. It's recreation. Like a rubics cube.

You look at any Mac shill site, or unix hints site, and it's the same thing. It's NEVER about finding the best, easiest, or most intuitive way to do a job. It's about showing off how arcane and elaborate your solution is to your fellow geeks in the club.

If the answer is too easy, these guys friggin' hate it. It has to be loaded with mumbo jumbo, inelegant workflows, or McGyvered third party hardware solutions.

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Originally posted by thalo:
I read stuff like that, and can't BELIEVE that there are pros in the world who don't consider OS X a beta platform.

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Some of my experiences with "pros" are:

- They don't care about an OS or a technical detail in the first place, they want the shit to be done.

- They're mostly non-geeky, don't give a shit about that little pixel and this font here and there.

- They may think OS-X is a beta platform, on the other hand FinalCUT is OS-X only and i've heard it does it's job quite good.

- IF they think OS-X is beta'ish, they quickly change OS and APP, they don't call Apple and moan for this & that AND they don't wait for features added or bugs squashed, they simply leave the platform.

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and some free moaning from me: Apple CAN do stuff for pros, just look at the pro-apps, they even sport a better lean UI (ok, speed is bound to SlowQua™)... I imagine Apple to deliver a clean 2D-UI in 2007, declaring it to be "groundbreaking". Da muss ich brechen (break->german: brechen->puke)...

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They're mostly non-geeky, don't give a shit about that little pixel and this font here and there.

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I disagree. Pros are highly detail oriented. Apple has merely become way less so.

More attention to detail in this operating system, as well as a better sense of "the big picture"... meaning the primacy of the user experience, would get us out of this crap-festival that we're in.

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Originally posted by thalo:

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They're mostly non-geeky, don't give a shit about that little pixel and this font here and there.

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I disagree. Pros are highly detail oriented. Apple has merely become way less so.

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Hmm, that depends i would say. I have experienced that most "pros" i met weren't that detail-fanatic as i am. Maybe i met the wrong pros, but i still think it's a small percentage of pros that are that much detail oriented as we are.

And this is IMHO one of the main reasons for Apple TO CHANGE NOTHING about the UI, because if all pros would moan, call, write to apple something would happen fast.

Also, the term "pros" is very broad, there are many different shades of pro. And then we have pro-pros. arghl... i stop now.

I think it boils down to crap-settlers, vs. people who don't like to settle for crap.

slack-cutters, vs. people who don't cut that much slack to slackers.

In my industry, pros who aren't detail oriented, don't get very far. Clients aren't often forgiving of work that has mistakes in it.

And even though I'm an Apple FAN, I find myself forgiving way too many egregious errors and mistakes. I'm settling for poor performance and an over-designed casual use interface, because of why again? Some kind of altruism? A company that could buy and sell me a million times over... needs ME to keep my mouth shut when they fuck up? Nah-ah, sorry, I 'm not buying it.

They can do better. And it's time for us to stop dancing around that issue. Apple Computer was the last company I'd have pegged as an underachiever, but that's exactly what's come to pass.

They're more concerned about keeping the PR machine going, than listening to their loyal customers.

Is this guy a pro?

http://www.usatoday.com/life/movies/news/2004-09-06-star-wars_x.htm


John Lowry is the unseen force behind the sparkling new DVD versions of George Lucas' Star Wars films, which arrive Sept. 21 in a four-disc $70 box set.

Lowry mobilized the forces: 80 employees and 600 networked Power Mac G5 computers with the equivalent of 378 terabytes (378 million megabytes) of hard-disk storage.

Is this guy a pro?

John Lowry is the unseen force behind the sparkling new DVD versions of George Lucas' Star Wars films, which arrive Sept. 21 in a four-disc $70 box set.

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Over the past four years, Lowry Digital Images has emerged as the pre-eminent destination for studios looking to prepare their classics for DVD. Having cleaned up the Indiana Jones films for last year's DVD package to the satisfaction of Lucas, director Steven Spielberg and studio Paramount, the Burbank-based firm earned the chance this year to do the same for the Star Wars trilogy.

Even though the original film elements of the three movies have spent most of their time resting in vaults, they had gathered wear and tear that would have been noticeable had they been transferred, as is, straight to DVD.

"The most popular movies are often, by far and away, in the worst shape," Lowry says. "They have been printed more often and been duplicated more often, and each of those passes adds scuffs, dirt, scratches and the like."

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I wasn't aware that Star Wars wasn't out on DVD. You tend to see a movie such as this repackaged into so many minimally-different products (Special Edition, a Director's Cut, a Special Director's Cut, etc.) that it seems surprising that they still had something as major as DVD left to do. But even after this is done, I'm pretty they'll find new and creative ways to resell the same thing over and over again. Perhaps Lucas will want to do a violence-free version of Star Wars. (I have in mind that idiotic change to the Star Wars Cantina scene between Han and Guido). Darth Vader will spread terror throughout the galaxy with his threat to come to your planet and wear lots and lots of black out of season. Obi Wan will give Luke a light saber and show him how to make scary shadow puppets; the kind that are scary enough to drive away any perpetrator of a fashion faux pas. Etc., etc.

So the short answer is, yes, John Lowry is a pro if he can manage to transfer Star Wars onto DVD without turning it into another movie. Good luck, John.

That guy is a pro.

And that's some serious computing power. SIX HUNDRED G5's networked? Holy crap.

I think this speaks to the difference between raw crunching SERVER power, and personal-computer DESIGN power.

I think you have made a case for the G5 having the former. Set parameters, and let the thing crank away... put all its power into one task, like DNA sequencing or mapping the heavens. That's traditionally the crap unix is good at.

So why does that kind of power fall apart and work like a slug when somebody like moi has to work on ONE photoshop project, or has to design ONE print catalog.

I say it's because I'm more involved with my project. I'm giving the machine constant user input. I'm changing the rules on it every second, and it can't keep up.

Notice how when they demo how great OS X is for pros, they always pull the same shit? They ALWAYS set a few filters, trigger the demo, and sit back and watch them crank.

Very sneaky. Always gives an impressive result against Windows. But that's nowhere NEAR close to how human beings work. And that's where the legacy was great, and OS X sucks.

And again, it comes back to interface. Geeks don't NEED the interface. They will set their parameters, run their apps in a way more servery, hands-off way.

Designers and artists are more hands on. We work WITH applications, it's not as easy as running a filter, setting it and forgetting it.

It may very well be that the ONLY way Apple can function, is hands-off. It may very well be that the interface will NEVER be great unless we detach ourselves from it. Give it less "humanity" to deal with.

I just think that's going to be very unfortunate for my industry.

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Originally posted by Brad Nelson:
(I have in mind that idiotic change to the Star Wars Cantina scene between Han and Guido)

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Heh it's Greedo, and as a matter of fact, Lucas DID change it. Again.

http://www.scifi.com/scifiwire/art-main.html?2004-09/08/10.30.film

"a compromise to the infamous Star Wars cantina shooting, in which Han Solo (Harrison Ford) and Greedo now shoot at each other at the same time,"

You can thank friggin' ACTION FIGURES for that. All those kids buying little Greedos and seeing them as cute harmless and cuddly, instead of bloodthirsty bounty hunters.

"Mommy? Why does Han shoot greedo?"

Now all mothers can go: "they shot EACH OTHER, honey"

[eye roll]

Arlo corrected: Heh it's Greedo

Then who the hell is Guido? That name sure rings a bell with me. Maybe I was referring to the Scorsese Cut version of Star Wars where Han guns down a member of the mafia in the cantina.

and as a matter of fact, Lucas DID change it. Again.

Is zat right? I think that version is just as dumb and shows just how right Lucas got it the first time when Han shoots Greedo before Greedo can shoot him…and this is OBVIOUSLY what was going to happen. The scene was perfect. It was self-defense on Han's part but a bit of a shady self-defense at that. Perfect.

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You can thank friggin' ACTION FIGURES for that. All those kids buying little Greedos and seeing them as cute harmless and cuddly, instead of bloodthirsty bounty hunters.

"Mommy? Why does Han shoot greedo?"

Now all mothers can go: "they shot EACH OTHER, honey"

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LOL. That's probably at least partially correct. My impression is that Lucas simply did a PC wimp-out on that, the same as Spielberg removing guns from the agents (cops, whatever) who were chasing the kid and creature in ET. Dumb. Please do not give these supposed geniuses the keys to old movies like Casablanca. They'd turn the movie and the whole struggle with the Nazis into some kind of dispute over boarding an over-booked airplane. They would have had to cut that stirring impromptu singing of La Marseillaise because it would have seemed too aggressive and divisive. I can see it now. Sitting inside Rick's Café, the Germans and the French would start singing their respective songs at the same time. This would be after, of course, Lucas had tried a version with the French jumping to their feet to sing their national anthem first. Ooops. That didn't work. Let's try it with the Germans and French singing at the same time. Ahhhh. That's better. After all, what we want TODAY is for the French and Germans to get along. Mustn't show any dischord...even if it is a part of actual history.

There’s a rumor (or speculation) going around that Lucas has made more changes to the original Star Wars trilogy than he did for the last tape release, when the special effects were spruced up. This time, rumor has it, he has changed some elements so that they dovetail more closely with the crappy prequel trilogy.

So don’t rush to buy it. Wait for the reports and feedback of the early buyers. Based on the last two junk movies, Lucas can’t be trusted not to ruin the original trilogy. Jar-Jar Binks in the Cantina anyone?

Markle

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There’s a rumor (or speculation) going around that Lucas has made more changes to the original Star Wars trilogy than he did for the last tape release, when the special effects were spruced up. This time, rumor has it, he has changed some elements so that they dovetail more closely with the crappy prequel trilogy.

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Crappy prequel trilogy. I heartily agree, Markle, although I thought #2 was a distinct improvement over #1. It had less Jar-Jar Binks for starters. Maybe that was all it needed to qualify as better. Has anyone seen that fan-edited version of #1 that’s floating around out there? I’ve heard it’s a vast improvement.

In principle, I don’t have a problem with a director going back and cleaning things up and even adding a bit of eye candy here and there – and perhaps doing a couple of things that they just couldn’t do before, such as Han interacting and walking around Jabba the Hut – particularly if it is THEIR film (Hear that, you dumb ass, Ted Turner?) And when all was said and done, I think most of the changes to Star Wars #4 (A New Hope) were good ones…except for the idiotic cantina scene between Han and Cheetoh. I thought most of the changes blended in well. They weren’t jarring or look out of place. Of course, it’s inevitable that Star Wars fans when viewing an edit like this for the first time will focus quite of bit of their attention on finding the stuff that has been changed or been added.

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Based on the last two junk movies, Lucas can’t be trusted not to ruin the original trilogy. Jar-Jar Binks in the Cantina anyone?

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LOL. I see we share an equal hatred (and I don’t think hatred’s too strong a word) for Jar-Jar Binks. I’d like to see his guts splattered all over the floor and wall in the next movie.

I wish I could have been privy to the conversation when someone said George why didn't you start from the beginning instead of jumping to the middle of the story you dumbass?

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Crappy prequel trilogy. I heartily agree, Markle, although I thought #2 was a distinct improvement over #1.

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Yes, Yoda’s light-saber fight in #2 was worth the price of admission. But that was about all.

Lucas was on Charlie Rose tonight, and admitted that he decided to go back to Star Wars to raise money to do other things. That would explain the obvious heavy presence of merchandising and video game elements in these new movies, which seem to have no other real plot necessities (such as the never-ending pod race in #1). But even in Return of the Jedi, with the cutesy Ewocks and that jet-cycle chase through the forest, that extraneous commercialization was already being shoehorned in.

We’re supposed to be seeing the anger and resentment in Anniken Skywalker that would later turn him into Darth Vader. But so far he hasn’t shown anything any different than any other sullen, moody teenager.

Markle

P.S.

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particularly if it is THEIR film (Hear that, you dumb ass, Ted Turner?)

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This is actually a deep philosophical matter. Someone may own a film in its physical and legal (copyright) sense, but not necessarily in its artistic sense. Turner may have the RIGHT to do whatever he wants to when he owns a movie, but we also have the right to say he’s a cretin for doing it. Lucas is a different story, because he alters his own creations. We may disagree and think it’s a shame to change the movies we know and love, but if the changes are something we don’t like, all we can do is register our protest, refuse to buy the altered versions, and content ourselves with the originals that we may already have on tape.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Markle,

That would explain the obvious heavy presence of merchandising and video game elements in these new movies, which seem to have no other real plot necessities (such as the never-ending pod race in #1).

Before mass merchandising caught on, I guess the main, if not the only, consideration when making a movie was the selling of tickets. Back then, the creative staff involved in the production of a movie needed to think only of pleasing those who were sitting in the seats of the movie theatre. Now the movie isn't quite an end in itself. Now it's watered down with all sorts of mini-commercials. The pod race was one of those commercials, as you said. I don't think the sequence added much to the story. It seemed a quite pointless side trip. It was exciting and believable for about the first minute…if that.

But even in Return of the Jedi, with the cutesy Ewocks and that jet-cycle chase through the forest, that extraneous commercialization was already being shoehorned in.

Yes, but to my mind the jet-cycle race was pure action/adventure fun. If it was also a vehicle for selling crap, well, I guess it just didn't seem so obvious. It could (and did, I think), in theory, masquerade as just good old-fashioned Saturday matinee stuff. Okay, we know these days that movies are also laying the groundwork for selling merchandise. I suppose it's not too much to expect that the better producers and directors should try and integrate these commercials into the story better so they blend in and don't stand out as jarring infomercials. I imagine brother thalo is the nuclear equivalent, but if you could harness the power of my eye rolls when I see the OBVIOUS Coke can stuck in my face in some movie. They don't even try to integrate this stuff sometimes. How long will it be until there's a pause in the movie and some walk-on character says "Welcome to the middle of the move, brought to you by CityBank. What's in your wallet?"

We’re supposed to be seeing the anger and resentment in Anniken Skywalker that would later turn him into Darth Vader. But so far he hasn’t shown anything any different than any other sullen, moody teenager.

Really, that's another excellent commentary on the prequel. Ditto. High five. I agree. It's been a very lame handling of his character development. As Rico intimated, it was a tough row to hoe making a prequel after such a successful "middle" 4, 5 and 5 Star Wars films. The problem was is that we knew how all this turns out, so 1, 2 and 3 can't try to hold together on plot alone. But that seems to be what they've done. The characters are often paper thin. The dialogue often lacking depth. And really, especially in #1, the plot doesn't even hold together all that well. What you have in essence is a special effects feast and a director (Lucas) who is seemingly trying to ride the coattails of another successful director (a younger Lucas). But as far as being a money-maker, the films were incredibly successful. I just don't think they are artistic successes, beyond the special effects aspect of the films.

My criticism of the first two movies is that none of them were dark enough. And when they finally GOT dark, as in Annakin killing the whole village of the Sandpeople, I didn't buy it. Hayden Christiansen is not carrying the role. He hasn't been able to communicate the arrogance or aristocratic airs that show he feels superior in abilities to his teachers. He should be a young smoldering Heathcliff; instead he's just a dorky digi-jedi.

The kid playing Lex Luthor in "Smallville" is much better at foreshadowing his evil destiny. He's a much stronger actor. Whenever Hayden explodes, it always sounds whiny and girly.