Safari has been really buggy with me. Something definitely breaks on it with use. I normally am able to access my ROUTER with the browser, but after a while of using Safari, it eventually refuses to access the page.

I get this error in the Console log:

quote:

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2004-08-10 21:44:44.522 Safari[481] *** Assertion failure in -[BrowserApplication _commonBeginModalSessionForWindow:relativeToWindow:modalDelegate:didEndSelector:contextInfo:], AppKit.subproj/NSApplication.m:2763
2004-08-10 21:44:44.523 Safari[481] Modal session requires modal window

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I have Safari on my laptop, same version of the OS, and it works fine. This has happened to me before. Something about drawing the SHEET (the window where I'm supposed to login to the router page with my admin password)... breaks. I've tried reinstalling the application to no avail. The only thing that has worked in the past is a FULL SYSTEM REINSTALL. And as much as I need to access my router, hey, I might as well use IE. It's just amazing to me how flaky Safari gets.

Anyone have any ideas how to fix this issue, short of reinstalling the whole operating system? And why THIS PARTICULAR thing, drawing the sheet, would keep breaking just for this location?

That's because Safari is betaware for morons.

Now don't go crying that you are a moron.

I said no such thing jackass.

This was over on Apples boards:

1. Download the latest version of Safari from Apple (this is essential to do before anything else)
2. Locate the webkit files and stick them in the trash: System/Library/Frameworks/webkit.frameworks (these are used to connect to the web - if you fail to follow step 1, you will kick yourself as you will not be able to connect using ftp, http etc etc)
3. Install Safari from your fresh download
4. Restart
5. Run permissions repair in Disk Utility
6. Rejoice as your contextual meanus reappear in Safari

Found thru this thread.

Follow the link from there for the fix.

Brother whalo, brother Rico, god bless you both. Trashing the webkit was the missing piece of the puzzle.

That did the trick. Now I want to know why it keeps breaking. I mean it's like SO MUCH in this OS... there are just certain things, certain prefs, I know are going to turn up dead after just going about my daily business. Isn't that so wrong? Shouldn't that friggin' NOT HAPPEN? Is it just me, or does application and system reliability count for anything?

OK, the legacy crashed on me once in a while, but know what? It was a more stable platform. The Mac user experience seemed to get BETTER with use. I used to feel that I could trick out my system and customize it for my particular workflow. When I do that with OS X, there are all these irritating times when my customizations get totally iced. Forgotten. Prefnesia.

In the legacy, we had an extensions manager for troubleshooting. X-men go on and on about oh, how terrible those days were. Know what? They were NOTHING compared to trying to track down OS X's flaky bullshit. I swear, I end up trashing plists and prefs files so much after apps start going screwy (and FORGETTING my prefs)... that I swear, there should be a menu command for that. A manager app, no no wait, a SERVICE. Might as well have ONE that does something worthwhile. How about "Repair"... and it just trashes the prefs of whatever application you are in. And restarts.

For all the whining X-Men do over how much restarting they had to do in the legacy, all I can say is, I do WAY more reinstalling, restarting, logging out and in... than I EVER did in OS 9. And it's because OS X is too easy to break. It breaks apps.

I'm the kinda guy that has to know WHY the webkit breaks, just with simple use. And why it broke for one of the most important addresses I go to: my router admin pages.

quote:

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Originally posted by thalo:
In the legacy, we had an extensions manager for troubleshooting. X-men go on and on about oh, how terrible those days were. Know what? They were NOTHING compared to

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YEAH! YEAH! YEAH! ...

And i have another story, after OS9 came up i heard from friends that different extension-manager setups weren't neccessary anymore. THey told something like current macs were fast enough to load all that crap and os9 is capable to handling endless extensions without hiccups.
I NEVER heard a logical reason for this, i guess it's one of the urban myths.

And the sick result is, many OS9 Users had tons of extensions and didn't care about them because of that urban myth. So their OS9 crashed a little more... And so they couldn't wait for X. That crashes too and is slow like a pizza crawling down a hill... but it's NEW. :-/

Of course, I still use different setups for general work, music production, etc.. IT JUST works better this way.

just my 2 cents...

The problem is,
PERCEPTION of stability has become more important, than, well, STABILITY. Blame-shifting any accountability off the OS has given us the most unreliable, half-assed Mac OS in history, not to mention the most unreliable, half-assed native apps.

Look, the fact of the matter, in as plain english as I can muster, is that hiding an operating system's flaws and weaknesses, ain't the same as friggin' FIXING them. Burying them under yards of crap, misdirection, and eye candy, so newbies and casual users don't notice them, ain't fixing them either.

Fixing them is fixing them.

The solution to Services that don't work, isn't ignoring the fact that the original conception of the OS had SERVICES! The answer to a help system that is inconsistent, unfinished, and all over the place, isn't just LEAVING it unfinished. ESPECIALLY when you are interested in attracting newbies and casual users. I mean, hell, they go to help more than I do.

But you know what? Help could REALLY be help. It could be the penultimate vehicle for DEMYSTIFYING UNIX. It could be the source for all the bullshit like my recent Safari problem. If something in the Frameworks breaks, then a help file should be where you go to peruse SYMPTOMS and get fixes. If you need some command-line code to type in your terminal to fix something, help is where it should be.

I'm sorry, but these are PERSONAL COMPUTERS. We shouldn't have to have a PET GEEK to troubleshoot for us. Not a "genius" either. We should be able to do it ourselves. In the legacy, we were in the driver's seat. In OSX, the geek aristocracy is in the driver's seat, and we're the rubes. We're getting cheated, reamed, bent over a barrel and outraged.

The Mac has always been, and should continue to be... LIBERATING. Now? It's friggin' enslaving. It used to make us independent, now it makes us DEPENDENT. And it's all because Apple won't grab every opportunity to make it intuitive, easy to use and maintain, easy to troubleshoot and fix.

Their attitude is more along the lines of, hey, we can make MORE MONEY if our customers don't know what the fuck is going on, ever. Well, to me, that's evil. The Mac used to be about stamping down that crap. Thwarting big brother. Now, Apple IS big brother.

And I honestly, honestly don't think they're cut out for it. I think they did a better job when they went TO BAT for the little guy, the end user. When they made a point NOT to con us or take advantage of us.

We had a better product when our interests came before theirs. That's supposed to be the way it is, when you are making tools FOR people. Sorry, but they have to be GOOD. A car you have to take to a mechanic every 10 miles is, hands? Right, a lemon.

OS X is a candy-coated, visually superabundant, slow lemon. Dependency software. With Apple the ennabler. Well, it's time for thalo's twelve step program.

The first thing WE have to do as loyal Apple customers, is show that we won't stand for being lied to, or taken for a ride. We have to tell Apple, hey, you promised us better and didn't deliver.

You're so worried about music and iPods, you are forgetting to make good operating systems, which are FAR more important to people who work for a living, people who used to comprise the lion's share of your customer base. What about us, huh?

Somebody needs to tell me why my fonts keep breaking in Safari. I can almost set my clock by it. After using the app for a while, eventually the fonts go completely screwy on me. The most noticable thing, is that BOLD faces completely disappear. As in, they simply do NOT show up on any web page, including thalo.net. Whether the html is bold-tagged or CSS styled bold, it just doesn't get parsed.

That's a bug. But it's one of those that rears over time. Seems the more I use the browser, the more likely it is to degrade and get corrupted in this way.

Your distorted memory/history of Mac OS 9 leaves out that you guys were no mere casual users...you were the Mac Gurus of your coworkers and families and friends.

Honest to God regular people had a tough time with Mac troubleshooting/maintenance and usage.

Your biggest problem is that you invested all your guruness in an OS that was murdered by Jobs, and now you need to re-certify your guruness with a totally different OS. You're older and learning it all is a monumentally boring, aggravating task.

But this is because you're going from guru to newbie overnight and the climb to Mac OS X guru is a steep one and not worth the effort to some of you.

Most people flocked to Windows 95 thinking (in a Titanic kind of tragic way) that it was easier/better than Mac OS...Today the last remnants of Mac users jump or are pushed into Mac OS X.

I seriously think there are, at worst, an identical number of problems with Mac OS 9 and Mac OS X for regular users. It's just that so few of the solutions memorized for Mac OS 9 have any pertinence in Mac OS X.

Eventually your Mac OS 9 and Mac OS X guruness will equal out and when that happens you'll feel comfy in Mac OS X although you'll always bitch no matter what because of irrational Steve Jobs associations.

I dunno man,
I had plenty of contact with unix back in the dark ages. I was ENOUGH of a geek to get by and seem a guru. And these days, I can wow other Mac people and PLAY at geek aristocrat. I just friggin' hate it.

Because it all seems so useless to me. Old poweruser routines were liberating, because they were so much less arcane, and MORE commonsense.

In other words, the LANGUAGE we all had to learn was visual, and more intuitive. The time spent being a newbie was short, because there was an internal logic and small user end skillset.

The mac of the legacy days was not JUST visual. It was visual and powerful. And meaningful. Now, it's SUPER visual, supersized, but disorganized, illogical, with a freakin' HUGE skillset, and instead of building on the idea that the end user has personal computing power, instead communicates that the end user is a retard, and without paying an IT guy to bail us out, we're up crap's creek.

We went from fair and smart and egalitarian to bureaucratic, arcane, aristocratic and ridiculous. It's not simply that the Mac has become a casual use machine. Hey, it was called that back in the early days. But the difference is this. Now, Apple looks down its nose at casual users and newbies, and doesn't offer up the Mac's secrets. It does to developers, to geek aristocrats, people with juicy chessclub brains... but it doesn't make app use easy.

And when there's trouble? Shit, it's ALWAYS our fault, whether it is or not. Apple's got it win-win. They can provide crap, fix nothing, and it's so arcane, that they can always point to pilot error as the reason for its shortcomings. There's nothing protecting us as consumers from being taken for a ride.

Grifters call this a gimme. Even if the con is blown, they get off scott free, because the mark will blame themselves.

This is like religion. A bible scholar or theologian can control and manipulate people with scripture, because it's a complex text. They can show off their special knowledge, and make new believers feel inferior. If they get out of line, quote a few arcane bible verses and set them straight.

That's where we are with the Mac. You look at the guys on other boards who are in their friggin' GLORY because people need them. A good Personal computer, like the Mac was, wouldn't.

Sounds like a font problem.

Maybe Font Cache Cleaner will help.

Check MacUpdate for user feedback about Font Cache Cleaner.

quote:

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Maybe Font Cache Cleaner will help.

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Had it, tried it, no dice.

Still, there is no sign of any BOLD FACE anywhere, on any site, any font in Safari. Explorer and other browsers show them fine. Tried trashing the Safari plist. Tried restarting. Nope and nope.

Bold is gone. How irritating. Yeah, let me go test web sites in Safari, can't even parse friggin' bold.

What did I tell you. You want to play with a beta piece of shit you are going to have problems.

I had to see an eye specialist after only several hours of using XP. Apparently my cornia's have been lunafied. They said it is similar to looking at a solar eclipse only backwards. Now I have to wear specially tinted glasses.

The only thing that worked, somehow, was following this ridiculous circuitous path:

trash webkit
reinstall Safari
restart
repair permissions
reinstall font HELVETICA
load it with SUITCASE instead of Font Book

Here's a cool feature in Safari. You can highlight a word (or phrase), right-click on it, and you'll have the option to look it up in Dictionary, Spotlight, or Google. That's darn useful.

I figured the Dictionary option would just take me to the Dictionary in Spotlight. But then I found out that there is an app called "Dictionary" in the Applications folder that can be kept open in a separate window. That's great...except that it would be nice to have that dictionary function be at-the-ready a la Spotlight's menubar interface. Maybe something like InDesign’s Drop Drawersian side tabs. I know it’s there is Spotlight but something about the Spotlight interface just seems so cumbersome. It feels like one first has to switch into another mode. And then the information that one is looking for can’t be referenced in the context of, say, some web page that one is looking at. You have to switch back and forth between them. Thalo may have been right about the “junk drawer” nature of Spotlight. Even though there are some nifty widgets in there, I find myself not using them because of the bother.

There's also the dictionary/thesaurus widget, which believe it or not I've found fairly handy. And "superabundant" is in there.

The trouble with widgets, is that you have to call/dismiss them from Dashboard. After working with dashboard for a while now, I don't think we needed an extra separate environment.

The ONLY good thing about it, is that it has an effective use of "dimming" the stuff behind it, making all the widgets pop with color and contrast. I'd like to see that used elsewhere in the Mac interface. It's quite effective.

There's also the dictionary/thesaurus widget, which believe it or not I've found fairly handy. And "superabundant" is in there.

Yeah. I find that handy, although I'm tending toward keeping the stand-alone application open so that it can be Exposed to or (and I haven't done this yet) I can assign a macro hotkey to launch it. I normally use Dictionary.com for the dictionary/thesaurus but it's a bit slow these days. Maybe it's a victim of some success, I don't know. But the nice think is that it will offer you some "Did you mean?" Google-like suggestions if you're not sure how the world is spelled. I don't think the Tiger widget or the stand-alone app do that. You pretty much have to know how a word is spelled. I don't have it in front of me at the moment so I'm not sure of that.

And I've actually forgotten which words are thaloisms and which are not. Some of them I use quite a bit. And no, not just to needle Phil. They've simply become a habit. I wasn't sure about superabundant but I just looked in my 1974 Webster's New Collegiate Dictionary and, sure enough, superabundant is listed in it. The definition is: More than ample, excessive, visually busy and Tiger-ish. (LOL. Made that last one up). But I don't see visual-superabundant in there. That's an original. Interesting, there's also a word right above it in Webster's, "superabound". Heck, that's got to be good for describing something in OS X. Superabound: to abound or prevail in greater measure or to excess. Now, let's see if I can use that in a sentence:

Markle superabounds at short witticisms and off-the-cuff dry humor.

An "undo last closed page or tab" would be a handy feature for Safari. I say this through gritted teeth. I'm trying to be nice. I don't know why. But I'm trying.

quote:

Originally posted by the man in black:
Your distorted memory/history of Mac OS 9 leaves out that you guys were no mere casual users...you were the Mac Gurus of your coworkers and families and friends.

Honest to God regular people had a tough time with Mac troubleshooting/maintenance and usage.

Your biggest problem is that you invested all your guruness in an OS that was murdered by Jobs, and now you need to re-certify your guruness with a totally different OS. You're older and learning it all is a monumentally boring, aggravating task.

But this is because you're going from guru to newbie overnight and the climb to Mac OS X guru is a steep one and not worth the effort to some of you.

Most people flocked to Windows 95 thinking (in a Titanic kind of tragic way) that it was easier/better than Mac OS...Today the last remnants of Mac users jump or are pushed into Mac OS X.

I seriously think there are, at worst, an identical number of problems with Mac OS 9 and Mac OS X for regular users. It's just that so few of the solutions memorized for Mac OS 9 have any pertinence in Mac OS X.

Eventually your Mac OS 9 and Mac OS X guruness will equal out and when that happens you'll feel comfy in Mac OS X although you'll always bitch no matter what because of irrational Steve Jobs associations.

You know, it's quite logical: OS9 was easy not only in use but also architecturally. There is a connection between how a piece of software is designed and how it is used. Anybody who ever read Inside Macintosh can certify that MacOS had a clear structure. It did get somewhat bloated over the years, but now look at OS X: Two different, totally redundant kernel models (BSD and MAch) plus the I/O-Kit deep down, a non-UNIX filesystem thrown into the mix, all the NeXT garbage, Carbon added on top, tons of opensource stuff (without CUPS OS X still wouldn't be able to print), and all the gimmicks like Spotlight, File Vault, whathaveyou added on top.

Such bloated crap CANNOT be easy to use.

Every time i use OS X i'm amazed that this cobbled-together mishmash of components that were never ever meant to be glued together actually does anything at all.

Every time i use OS X i'm amazed that this cobbled-together mishmash of components that were never ever meant to be glued together actually does anything at all.

I'll second that.

All KINDS of Safari crap today. Just kept crashing and crashing. Freezing, so I force quit... then it would crank for a while and the app would quit.

I tried what I normally do, first clearing the cache, then the more drastic "resetting"... after that you have to quit the app and delete the plist. Typical OS X bullshit nursemaiding.

But this time the crashing was still coming hard and fast. That's when you have to look at the Activity monitor, and start trying to find anomalies. In this case, it was apparently the "loginwindow" process. It was using up an inordinate amount of CPU. That's a bood process, so I knew there was trouble. At that point I couldn't restart, or force-quit anything. I stopped the process and the computer hard crashed.

Now I defy anybody to tell me that troubleshooting and nursemaiding isn't way more involved than it ever was. Most people have no idea what the hell half the processes ARE in their Activity Monitors. And when crap goes buggy without warning, it's FAR more irritating than anything OS 9 use to throw at me. Because it's all a fucking mystery. There's so much little shit that can go wrong or get flaky.